Top-of-Funnel Marketing Why It's Risky in Google Ads

John: 00:00:11

We are in a horrible, horrible, horrible position for top of funnel.

John: 00:00:14

As a performance driven agency, we are responsible for sales for roaz,

John: 00:00:20

and then they have to fight the client that the direct and organic is also

John: 00:00:23

because of us that Google is not tracking, especially top of funnel.

John: 00:00:27

But what we have to do is get very, very, very good at explaining that

John: 00:00:30

top of the funnel is not RO as driven.

John: 00:00:33

If you need to look at anything first, look at your overall m e r or your overall

John: 00:00:38

media efficiency ratio, all cash out.

John: 00:00:40

Then second, look at your Google Ads account as a whole.

John: 00:00:49

Top of the funnel is, Extremely risky for us.

John: 00:00:56

We're a performance-driven agency.

John: 00:00:58

As a performance-driven agency, we are responsible for sales for roaz

John: 00:01:03

and then have to fight the client that the direct and organic is also because

John: 00:01:07

of us that Google is not tracking, especially top of funnel cuz the sales.

John: 00:01:12

Pipeline's too long and they don't wanna spend money on brand.

John: 00:01:14

We are in a horrible, horrible, horrible position for top of funnel.

John: 00:01:17

Facebook has done a really good job at educating all their clients

John: 00:01:20

that a one x return is fantastic.

John: 00:01:22

That's gold.

John: 00:01:22

That's amazing.

John: 00:01:23

If you, me, at one X, that's amazing.

John: 00:01:25

Bad marketers inside of Google who convinced all the clients that five

John: 00:01:27

x is fairly good because they were going after the brand name and,

John: 00:01:30

that's How did Facebook do that?

John: 00:01:31

Yeah.

John: 00:01:32

Facebook, and that's always been Regina.

John: 00:01:34

the reason why Facebook has done that is because every single

John: 00:01:38

Facebook marketer has said the same thing since the beginning of time.

John: 00:01:40

Because no one's been able to get a five x return on Facebook.

John: 00:01:43

Not consistently.

John: 00:01:44

Not normally.

John: 00:01:45

It's never happened before Google.

John: 00:01:47

It happens every single time.

John: 00:01:48

All I have to do is launch a DSA campaign, turns into brand.

John: 00:01:50

All I have to do is launch 10 different brand campaigns with 10

John: 00:01:53

different match types and audiences.

John: 00:01:54

Still all brand.

John: 00:01:55

Facebook does all the awareness.

John: 00:01:57

Google scoops up all the conversions for bad marketers

John: 00:02:00

that are just assuming brand was.

John: 00:02:03

And they don't look at the bigger picture.

John: 00:02:04

They don't look at the mer, they don't look at the overall roaz of the company.

John: 00:02:07

They don't look at the actual amount of sales or a conversion path.

John: 00:02:11

They don't investigate it.

John: 00:02:12

So if you could track a one x return on Facebook yeah, you're breaking even.

John: 00:02:16

Your cost of acquiring a new customer is zero.

John: 00:02:18

You are getting free customers.

John: 00:02:19

How many free customers would you like tomorrow?

John: 00:02:22

Mr.

John: 00:02:22

And Mrs.

John: 00:02:23

Business owner, and they've done that because that's been the norm.

John: 00:02:25

And then the Google people are like, wow, Facebook's doing great.

John: 00:02:28

As long as we just building a brand name.

John: 00:02:29

I can 10 x everything.

John: 00:02:30

So we just had a huge push in the industry on both sides, on Facebook and Google.

John: 00:02:34

That one X is good on Facebook, five on Google's normal and.

John: 00:02:38

The people that run both at the same time find out they have a three x return.

John: 00:02:41

And so they use their baseline for everything in life.

John: 00:02:42

Well, if you can gimme a three x return like I'm getting now, well, yeah.

John: 00:02:45

One X return on Facebook and an eight x return on Google does averaging out

John: 00:02:48

a three because one's going after cold, one's going after your brand traffic.

John: 00:02:51

You can see.

John: 00:02:51

Yeah.

John: 00:02:52

It explains what people are coming into five.

John: 00:02:53

Absolutely.

John: 00:02:54

it's exactly right.

John: 00:02:55

So you have bad marketers that are positioning their, stealing of other

John: 00:02:58

channels, traffic as their own, and now that's just the normal.

John: 00:03:01

inside of each channel, like that should just happen.

John: 00:03:04

Bigger companies know that smaller companies don't, but to go top of funnel,

John: 00:03:07

you have to be able to prepare your client for what they're going to be expecting.

John: 00:03:12

I forget who was, but someone came up with a strategy, I think

John: 00:03:15

two or three weeks ago to have.

John: 00:03:17

Budget, that's normal.

John: 00:03:19

And then exploratory budget.

John: 00:03:21

Does anybody remember who did that?

John: 00:03:22

I wanna make sure I give them proper credit for that.

John: 00:03:24

What does it me?

John: 00:03:25

feel like that was all of us, to be honest.

John: 00:03:27

I feel like we kind of brainstormed that.

John: 00:03:28

Oh, I might have just been the one to say it.

John: 00:03:31

. Okay.

John: 00:03:31

it was Caden's idea who was the first one to speak up.

John: 00:03:32

So now was your idea ? And by the way, that was a terrible idea.

John: 00:03:36

No, I'm kidding.

John: 00:03:37

I'm giving you Craig.

John: 00:03:37

Cause it was awesome.

John: 00:03:38

It was a smart idea.

John: 00:03:39

what we found out was some clients.

John: 00:03:41

I tried that a couple times.

John: 00:03:42

Some clients didn't really buy it.

John: 00:03:43

But I think it is a good way of speaking to them by saying, Hey, if

John: 00:03:45

we can have an overall roaz on an account, we're gonna go top of funnel.

John: 00:03:50

It's gonna look horrible.

John: 00:03:51

Don't shut it off cuz it's gonna kill the bomb of the funnel.

John: 00:03:54

But if we have the top of funnel, here's some things that we should do.

John: 00:03:57

I think and if anybody wants to fight me on this, happy to do so., display is our

John: 00:04:01

last channel to run I can't make run.

John: 00:04:03

I know people have cracked that code.

John: 00:04:05

I've never been able to do it.

John: 00:04:06

It just is too fatty of a network with absent kids game,

John: 00:04:09

even if we get rid of those.

John: 00:04:10

But when we're talking about building the brand, the most important thing you can

John: 00:04:14

do is run top of funnel brand awareness.

John: 00:04:17

Adds to a cold audience that is affinity and in market.

John: 00:04:22

So your two audiences for top of funnel, and we'll, talk about your

John: 00:04:24

question here in Regina in a minute.

John: 00:04:26

the audiences most often for top of funnel is gonna be in affinity and

John: 00:04:31

in market of Google's audiences.

John: 00:04:34

, I've been using this.

John: 00:04:34

Now it's not set in stone, it's just what I've, my experience has been, and we

John: 00:04:38

should test everything, but two audiences that we should always include is Google's

John: 00:04:42

own affinity and in market topics.

John: 00:04:45

A p i next year make sure that that's kind of the only thing that we.

John: 00:04:48

We can run, don't know just yet, but top of funnel audiences, affinity

John: 00:04:52

in market I think are the best.

John: 00:04:53

Why?

John: 00:04:53

Because Google actually tracks those people most often because it's a known

John: 00:04:57

audience that Google's monitoring.

John: 00:04:59

Without them having to jump through a special hoop in order for Google

John: 00:05:03

to keep an eye on them, it means it doesn't have to like visit website.

John: 00:05:06

Now they're marketing.

John: 00:05:07

Google has an audience that it knows it's the same people that Google said

John: 00:05:10

like, Hey, we think you're pregnant.

John: 00:05:11

Like they were telling the people that they're pregnant before

John: 00:05:13

they knew they were pregnant.

John: 00:05:13

That is what those engines are built off of.

John: 00:05:15

It's a self-learning monitoring system that predicts the point of success.

John: 00:05:18

So why wouldn't that be top of funnel?

John: 00:05:20

It's gonna be cheap.

John: 00:05:20

It's gonna be less expensive than doing inbound search at broad match.

John: 00:05:23

It's gonna be less expensive than using dsk because these

John: 00:05:26

audiences are much more plentiful.

John: 00:05:28

our CPMs are lower and our cpbs are usually lower with those audiences.

John: 00:05:34

Why?

John: 00:05:34

I don't know.

John: 00:05:35

I think it's just cuz they're so plentiful that Google's just.

John: 00:05:37

Loving on these people slowly and less intrusively.

John: 00:05:40

So it's costing us less.

John: 00:05:41

But the in markets and affinities I still think are relevant enough

John: 00:05:45

that you're going to generate that brand awareness on overall m e r.

John: 00:05:50

Now here's the bad is of those audiences, YouTube and discovery,

John: 00:05:54

I like better than display.

John: 00:05:55

GSPs fatty inside of discovery, but still less fatty than display.

John: 00:05:58

But I think the discovery in YouTube are our biggest low hanging fruits.

John: 00:06:03

I hear from a lot of clients that are in some.

John: 00:06:05

Nice, good circles asking me, Hey, we, were on YouTube.

John: 00:06:07

I know of these five companies, they spent a hundred million dollars a year

John: 00:06:09

on this and it's been working well.

John: 00:06:11

It seems to be YouTube and discovery is, the area that we should stick into.

John: 00:06:14

We've been testing 'em more and more.

John: 00:06:15

We've already proven YouTube works.

John: 00:06:16

I'm now getting into discovery.

John: 00:06:18

But what we have to do is get very, very, very good at at explaining that

John: 00:06:21

top of the funnel is not roaz driven.

John: 00:06:24

If you need to look at anything first, look at your overall m e r or

John: 00:06:28

your overall media efficiency ratio.

John: 00:06:29

All cash in, all cash out.

John: 00:06:31

Then second, look at your Google Ads account as a whole, and we can,

John: 00:06:35

front load that by having good Bob on the funnel type of campaigns.

John: 00:06:38

So the.

John: 00:06:39

Discover YouTube in market Infinity, that is going to be the audience targeting

John: 00:06:43

and that's gonna be the channel.

John: 00:06:44

Now, the offer and it's gonna sound kind of funny, is it's gonna be kind of

John: 00:06:47

like what we're doing in Solutions eight.

John: 00:06:48

I've been trying to apply my teachings to our own business and

John: 00:06:52

we've never Had higher quality or more plentiful leaflet than this.

John: 00:06:55

It's not gonna be right for every business, , it's not necessarily

John: 00:06:57

product awareness, it's more company and brand awareness.

John: 00:07:00

That top of the funnel is awkward.

John: 00:07:01

It's not conversion driven and it's not ro as focused or even click the rate

John: 00:07:06

focus, it's simply just brand awareness.

John: 00:07:08

And that's, that's the problem.

John: 00:07:09

Problem that is, gonna be very, very hard to measure.

John: 00:07:12

. But the way that we would measure it, Is exactly how I how I'm sharing with you

John: 00:07:16

my first go round anyway, with how I can measure it instead of just Google before

John: 00:07:19

I look at the back end of the website.

John: 00:07:21

What I mean by that is when I was running Performance Max, I was getting

John: 00:07:23

a $280 cost per acquisition when I'm running Feed only and YouTube.

John: 00:07:27

My one feed only campaign is now $125 cost per acquisition, it was cut by 60%.

John: 00:07:32

C p.

John: 00:07:33

One of the reasons is I'm remarketing all the traffic.

John: 00:07:35

I'm driving to the site.

John: 00:07:37

Is it all mine?

John: 00:07:37

No, there's Facebook in there.

John: 00:07:38

There's mine in there.

John: 00:07:39

What's happening to the overall m e r over 60% increase This client here.

John: 00:07:43

If I called him and said, Hey, I have $180 cost requisition and I

John: 00:07:47

need to be a one 20, he's gonna look at his sales essentially

John: 00:07:50

doubling and say, I don't care.

John: 00:07:52

Keep going.

John: 00:07:52

And when we talked to him on Wednesday, that's what he did.

John: 00:07:55

, he looked and said, all right, sounds good.

John: 00:07:56

Let's keep going.

John: 00:07:57

Be a little bit looser with your heavy KPIs and look at making

John: 00:08:02

sure everything like the client may not know what they need.

John: 00:08:04

that's a known fact.

John: 00:08:05

The client may not know exactly what they need and we can find

John: 00:08:08

the good and bad and then weigh the options in front of the client.

John: 00:08:12

Hey, your CPA's a little high, but you doubled your business.

John: 00:08:14

Well, that's okay for me.

John: 00:08:15

Let's keep going.

John: 00:08:16

Let's see if we can optimize down the cpa.

John: 00:08:18

I'm doubling my business.

John: 00:08:19

That's okay.

John: 00:08:19

But just know that if you can measure the bottom of the funnel,

John: 00:08:23

it'll allow you to earn more top of funnel in building that brand.

John: 00:08:25

The only thing that we're trying to do is try to get more people to the site that we

John: 00:08:28

can take credit for for those purchases.

John: 00:08:31

And that's what top of funnel is.

John: 00:08:32

It spawns more inbound brand searches.

John: 00:08:35

That's how you track it.

John: 00:08:36

If you can recapture or spawn more IM or or track more inbound

John: 00:08:40

branded searches, that is gonna be a good way to prove that model.

John: 00:08:43

. If you run more YouTube, you have to spend more on search branded to see

John: 00:08:47

is that also an increasing trend line?

John: 00:08:48

what will that do if you see that your CPA is staying about the same between

John: 00:08:53

a very high cpa, YouTube at a very low CPA brand, you've just increased.

John: 00:08:58

The volume for the same price.

John: 00:09:00

And then look at the m e r.

John: 00:09:00

That should hold true if your brand spends going up and your YouTube spends going

John: 00:09:04

up and your CPAs staying the same and the conversion are staying the same way.

John: 00:09:07

You can say, well, you're just robing organic and direct.

John: 00:09:09

Okay.

John: 00:09:09

Look at your overall m e r.

John: 00:09:11

Is your media efficiency ratio staying the same with the volumes going up?

John: 00:09:13

Yes.

John: 00:09:14

Case proven it's closed.

John: 00:09:16

I'm gonna pause there.

John: 00:09:16

I'm gonna answer Regina's questions.

John: 00:09:18

How do we talk to clients about an exploratory budget?

John: 00:09:20

I haven't heard this said yet.

John: 00:09:21

So ideal was saying like, Hey, do you have $2,000 a month in ad spend?

John: 00:09:24

Yes.

John: 00:09:24

What if we can spend 1500 of that for a three days return?

John: 00:09:27

But then we have spend 500 of that.

John: 00:09:28

For a zero Roaz just starting to generate that awareness.

John: 00:09:32

Zero roaz.

John: 00:09:33

Instead of Google Up, we'll look at So we have to look at, that's kind of a.

John: 00:09:36

Wait a segment off amount of money that is going to not have a RO as dedicated to

John: 00:09:40

it, like your YouTubes and your, discovery campaigns, all of those campaigns.

John: 00:09:44

But then on the flip side, you're gonna have a campaign that's gonna

John: 00:09:47

be high ro as direct response.

John: 00:09:49

would you apply type of funnel with the lead gen SaaS, local power

John: 00:09:51

directors, plumbing, et cetera.

John: 00:09:52

And the issues involved around it with lead forms, just focus on awareness and

John: 00:09:55

those clickthrough metrics, et cetera.

John: 00:09:57

Top of funnel.

John: 00:09:58

my question here is why would you wanna run top of funnel to a plumber?

John: 00:10:02

So, like, let's say that you have a certain, industry and they're

John: 00:10:05

like, okay, they're very local focused, but they want more clients.

John: 00:10:08

And their main issue, let's say, is they just don't have the volume

John: 00:10:13

on the search network anymore.

John: 00:10:14

Like, there's not people actively searching for that service in the.

John: 00:10:19

. Is there a top of funnel or I guess a thing that you can do in order

John: 00:10:23

to increase that volume overall?

John: 00:10:25

Is this specifically for plumber or is that just an example?

John: 00:10:27

Just an example.

John: 00:10:28

Like any local type lead generation account.

John: 00:10:32

Okay.

John: 00:10:32

A local lead generation is hard because I don't have a need for a plumber right

John: 00:10:35

now and nothing would convince me I do.

John: 00:10:37

Right.

John: 00:10:38

that's the part that I don't think that, like, you can have the best rotor, Rooter.

John: 00:10:41

I've known about them for 10 years.

John: 00:10:42

Never called them.

John: 00:10:44

I never needed them.

John: 00:10:45

I think that's like for local, that's service-based driven.

John: 00:10:48

That might be an area where Google is should not play in my opinion.

John: 00:10:52

Open, be challenged on that.

John: 00:10:53

You can spend a whole bunch of money with brand awareness, but don't.

John: 00:10:56

Anything to take place rather than, oh yeah, I heard about your ad, few months

John: 00:10:59

ago and I decided to give you guys a call.

John: 00:11:01

Like, is that data reflective?

John: 00:11:03

I don't think so.

John: 00:11:04

I guess a better comparison of a top of funnel would be how it does in

John: 00:11:08

comparison to like competitors per se.

John: 00:11:10

Meaning that like you have a certain slice of the pie that's.

John: 00:11:13

The amount of people that will, let's say get a plumber in

John: 00:11:16

the area, but they're debating between you versus another person.

John: 00:11:18

Do you think there's any space for you to essentially try to prove yourself

John: 00:11:22

as like the number one plumber in the area, or is it kind of just.

John: 00:11:25

One of those things where you just lean on reviews and then just go for

John: 00:11:28

bottom of funnel as much as possible.

John: 00:11:29

This is not a glitch.

John: 00:11:30

I'm interrupting the video you're watching because I need to remind

John: 00:11:33

you that I'm always looking for people to join our team.

John: 00:11:35

So if you're passionate about Google Ads and you wanna work with the best

John: 00:11:38

Google Ads agency on the planet, please go to so late.com/apply.

John: 00:11:41

Speaking of working with the best Google Ads agency on the planet, if you're

John: 00:11:44

having trouble with Google Ads and you want professional, That's what we do.

John: 00:11:48

You can go to so late.com, that's s o l eight.com to apply for your

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John: 00:12:01

that I know what I'm talking about.

John: 00:12:02

If you have questions, comments, concerns, or confessions,

John: 00:12:04

hit me blowing the comments.

John: 00:12:05

And now back to your regularly scheduled program.

John: 00:12:08

When you say competitive, could you repeat that part?

John: 00:12:10

I wasn't, following you there.

John: 00:12:11

Yeah, so like, let's say that there's like two plumbers in an area and you got one

John: 00:12:15

plumber that is newer in the marketplace, and then another one that's established.

John: 00:12:19

And so when people go online, they look at, you know, reviews or they look at

John: 00:12:23

just general knowledge of like, you just had wrote a router, you know that, so

John: 00:12:26

you're gonna go to that company instead.

John: 00:12:27

Is there, I guess any place for competitive branding

John: 00:12:31

in local campaigns for.

John: 00:12:34

I'm sorry, in like local type of companies, what's

John: 00:12:37

competitor branding mean?

John: 00:12:39

Meaning like saying like, Hey, our reviews are higher than like,

John: 00:12:41

so-and-so company kind of deal.

John: 00:12:43

Obviously it'd be a better worded than that, but something of that nature.

John: 00:12:46

Yeah, no, and that's, the part too.

John: 00:12:48

I think that there's absolutely always a place for that.

John: 00:12:51

That's why people run radio and TV and, billboard ads.

John: 00:12:53

Like you can't track a row as to that at all.

John: 00:12:56

You'll never be able to, it's.

John: 00:12:57

Impossible.

John: 00:12:58

Do you have the budget and are you big enough?

John: 00:13:00

And would the client agree that yes, always being top of mind, top dead

John: 00:13:03

center to my geographical audience is worthwhile for me to spend that

John: 00:13:06

exploratory, expendable budget on?

John: 00:13:09

Absolutely.

John: 00:13:10

Our job is to, I guess what I would say is not necessarily convince

John: 00:13:14

them our , job is to be able to do that the most effectively.

John: 00:13:18

And I think that that's where like the YouTube and discovery

John: 00:13:20

would make sense, where it's like, hey, case study before and after.

John: 00:13:22

Like see how they're used to have their couch floating in their living

John: 00:13:25

room and now look at it after they called emergency plumber For sure.

John: 00:13:28

Like those type of things are, absolutely needed.

John: 00:13:30

But if the client has got a $5,000 per month campaign, No.

John: 00:13:34

But if we say, Hey, we wanna spend 30 grand and we can only hit

John: 00:13:36

$10,000 of inbound traffic, what do we do with the other 20 grand?

John: 00:13:40

Oh yeah.

John: 00:13:40

I mean, YouTube and discovery for sure.

John: 00:13:42

it's gonna generate traffic when that person's ready.

John: 00:13:45

We're just not gonna run a YouTube a, it makes sense, pipe bursts really.

John: 00:13:49

And that's the part that I think that for like a local, it's

John: 00:13:52

gonna be very, very difficult.

John: 00:13:53

It's just traditional marketing on a digital channel really.

John: 00:13:56

So you'd pretty much just go back to the old rule of thumb, just tracking c p a

John: 00:14:00

change based off top of funnel awareness over whatever the bind period is.

John: 00:14:04

generally speaking, obviously just max out bottom of funnel

John: 00:14:07

first, which makes sense and.

John: 00:14:09

Test out top of funnel if they have extra budget to spend and then to gauge that.

John: 00:14:13

You look at overall, just seeing like over the next year your CPAs are

John: 00:14:17

slowly dropping or the average CPA is pacing lower than it was previously

John: 00:14:21

because of that awareness or whatever.

John: 00:14:22

It's all gonna come down to exactly how you measure it.

John: 00:14:24

If we're not measuring it by leads, because again, remember we only have

John: 00:14:28

90 days to convert that person 30 days on YouTube if they watch an ad.

John: 00:14:33

So just by sheer virtue of not being able to track a person after a month

John: 00:14:37

we'll never be able to measure it.

John: 00:14:39

And if you said, should we do this in the client's skip.

John: 00:14:41

Give us $10,000 a month and not care what happens to that

John: 00:14:44

within Google Ads all day long.

John: 00:14:47

Like, yes, that's an absolutely good idea.

John: 00:14:49

It's never a bad idea to become a household brand name in a local area.

John: 00:14:52

It's always a good idea.

John: 00:14:53

If you were gonna say, well, I need a hundred x row eyes on that.

John: 00:14:55

Never, never run it.

John: 00:14:56

that's, they're a hundred percent ROAS on it.

John: 00:14:58

That's, the bad part about that.

John: 00:14:59

Now, for sas for sure, cuz that's not gonna be local.

John: 00:15:02

You can generate, you know, case city use, case pain points,

John: 00:15:05

experiences goals in life status.

John: 00:15:07

Like, Hey, what if your company had this tool that can automate

John: 00:15:10

every report to everybody ever?

John: 00:15:11

Here's how we did that for.

John: 00:15:13

That's very top of funnel.

John: 00:15:15

very good use case, very good value first as to how this works and what it, what

John: 00:15:18

it, what it will allow a person to do.

John: 00:15:20

That's for sure when you're talking about other people that have had success.

John: 00:15:23

And you could also be that person too, for like sas.

John: 00:15:26

Yeah.

John: 00:15:26

And that actually can have a good C P C and then a good cost per

John: 00:15:30

digital market used to do something called C P P cost per pixel.

John: 00:15:33

And you say, what was the cost per pixel?

John: 00:15:35

And people were like, well, what the hell is that?

John: 00:15:36

And he goes, that's the amount of money that it costs us to get

John: 00:15:38

that person into our remarking list to then see what the CPA is.

John: 00:15:41

It was actually b.

John: 00:15:42

It wasn't just a visit, like it was actually like a person that was in the

John: 00:15:44

list that was matched and ready to go.

John: 00:15:46

So if you ran a top funnel campaign and your list now is a thousand match

John: 00:15:49

users, what is your cost per match user?

John: 00:15:51

And then that is, how you add that to your total after.

John: 00:15:54

Well also that people googled the brand name and that was a $7 conversion grade.

John: 00:15:56

You have an $8 26 cent CPA on that campaign.

John: 00:15:58

So you can do it that way where you can measure it, measure it that way.

John: 00:16:01

But again, after you max out uh, nationwide, direct response

John: 00:16:05

amount, SaaS, then you move up.

John: 00:16:07

Maybe not, maybe it's just too competitive at the bottom of the funnel to force

John: 00:16:10

you to go up, if that makes sense.

John: 00:16:11

But I think for, local specifically, I don't know how to measure local.

John: 00:16:14

Especially when they have a brick and mortar that's outside of Google, that

John: 00:16:18

gets in the realm of, you understand this is good, but we can't track it.

John: 00:16:20

Right?

John: 00:16:20

Yes.

John: 00:16:21

Okay.

John: 00:16:21

And it's not a good answer.

John: 00:16:22

if someone put the screws to me and said, John, what did that give you?

John: 00:16:24

I couldn't tell 'em.