Using Only Target ROAS Bidding for Standard Shopping Campaigns

John: 00:00:11

I only use T ROAS now for standard shopping exclusively.

2

: 00:00:20

Awesome.

3

: 00:00:20

I do want to mention the, the standard

shopping bidding strategy for Regina.

4

: 00:00:24

I only use TROAS now for

standard shopping exclusively.

5

: 00:00:28

the TROAS target is 100 percent unique to

that campaign and that company and that

6

: 00:00:34

goal and how aggressive we need to get.

7

: 00:00:37

what if you got an account that

had no data in it, really high

8

: 00:00:40

AOV and really low budget, would

you still use TROAS from day one?

9

: 00:00:44

Like worst case scenario, would you still,

yep, I would start at 40 percent TROAS.

10

: 00:00:49

Wow.

11

: 00:00:49

Okay.

12

: 00:00:50

But the algorithm, how can it get you

a return when it doesn't know anything?

13

: 00:00:54

40 percent is enough for it

to say, can you at least make

14

: 00:00:56

me 40 cents on every dollar?

15

: 00:00:58

It allows it to not spend stupidly

for too long on things that are

16

: 00:01:02

not working, but remain aggressive.

17

: 00:01:03

Okay.

18

: 00:01:04

Sorry.

19

: 00:01:04

one more, if it was an account

that sold like brand name products?

20

: 00:01:09

And you saw in the search terms that

the algorithm wasn't bidding on people

21

: 00:01:12

that are looking for those brand names.

22

: 00:01:14

It was just bidding on people

looking for the product, but

23

: 00:01:16

not the brand name, right?

24

: 00:01:17

So it's like high end

products with brand names.

25

: 00:01:19

Would you then override your T

ROAS strategy and use MaxCPC to

26

: 00:01:23

force it to pay more for a click?

27

: 00:01:24

yeah.

28

: 00:01:25

So this one, you'll see it's only

50 bucks a day, 80 bucks, 50, 80.

29

: 00:01:28

And all of a sudden this

thing spikes up to 700 a day.

30

: 00:01:31

And that's because my two row as I took

it down to 100, the rest is on 200 to

31

: 00:01:36

allow this to go really expensive and

it's popping a four 30, even though

32

: 00:01:40

I give it 100, it's giving me a 430.

33

: 00:01:43

The reason why is because

that is aggressive and these

34

: 00:01:47

here, that's what I said.

35

: 00:01:48

It's completely custom.

36

: 00:01:50

The reason why these bricks Samsonite

and Hartman are barely spending is

37

: 00:01:53

because that is below what I'm asking.

38

: 00:01:55

That is below what I'm asking.

39

: 00:01:56

That is a slightly above what I'm asking.

40

: 00:01:58

So it's spending more and that is

way overshooting what I'm asking.

41

: 00:02:01

So it's spending a lot.

42

: 00:02:02

the algorithm wasn't bidding on the

brand names, even though we did product

43

: 00:02:06

title rights, we put the brand name in

the first part of every product title.

44

: 00:02:10

So we thought that would be enough for

the algorithm to know what to bid on.

45

: 00:02:13

I honestly have done a TRO as a 5

percent before it's launched something.

46

: 00:02:16

I think what was throwing the

algorithm off is even though you're

47

: 00:02:19

giving it lots of freedom because

we gave it lots of freedom too.

48

: 00:02:22

think I did that strategy if not, I

had just had a wide open Maximized

49

: 00:02:26

conversions set on it for a while And

the problem is that 99 of the market

50

: 00:02:31

out there is looking for these products

But not looking for the brand name.

51

: 00:02:34

what was the brand if they sold

like 50 000 chandeliers to like

52

: 00:02:39

interior designers 1, 500 a month.

53

: 00:02:43

Yeah, you found it.

54

: 00:02:44

it's furniture.

55

: 00:02:45

So people are searching for table lamps

and she sells table lamps that are 4,

56

: 00:02:49

000, and unless they are searching for

the brand name with the table lamp,

57

: 00:02:54

so the algorithm doesn't have any data

because her budget is so low and, it's

58

: 00:02:59

getting all these clicks on people

looking for table lamps, one's the brand.

59

: 00:03:02

is that one of them?

60

: 00:03:03

Yeah.

61

: 00:03:04

Did we see how much our competitors

are bidding for that brand name?

62

: 00:03:06

I eventually did look up some of

the main brand names, not this one.

63

: 00:03:10

and it was a wide range,

which confused me.

64

: 00:03:12

It was anywhere between 90 cents and 15.

65

: 00:03:15

And I was just like,

it's all over the place.

66

: 00:03:18

It was a mystery.

67

: 00:03:19

So I eventually switched to MaxCPC

and I set 5 MaxCPCs to force

68

: 00:03:24

the algorithm to spend more.

69

: 00:03:25

But then we had no data because

we weren't getting any clicks.

70

: 00:03:28

So I was just like, I don't

know what's gonna work.

71

: 00:03:30

How was the feed though

from a description?

72

: 00:03:33

So it does say the name here.

73

: 00:03:34

So it should be okay.

74

: 00:03:36

It's right in the title.

75

: 00:03:37

Yeah, maybe this is a million times.

76

: 00:03:40

Her budget was too low and

that was the main issue.

77

: 00:03:42

So it was probably just a

doomed account from the start.

78

: 00:03:45

what I do know is like for, which is,

popular brand name and these people

79

: 00:03:48

spend a lot of money on their brand.

80

: 00:03:50

you really rarely.

81

: 00:03:52

We'll ever see any other competitor.

82

: 00:03:54

You'll see Monos here, but they

cover the brand name really well.

83

: 00:03:57

So my cost per click is 2 and 4.

84

: 00:03:59

Sometimes, I'm paying upwards

of, eight bucks for the brand

85

: 00:04:04

name and the product name.

86

: 00:04:05

and that's because this account

here at a hundred percent TROAS.

87

: 00:04:08

that was aggressive enough for it.

88

: 00:04:10

but do you see that it's not

necessarily also where majority

89

: 00:04:13

of my clicks are coming from?

90

: 00:04:14

I have backpacks, best

backpacks, best one here.

91

: 00:04:16

So it's still backpacks actually

at a 20 percent conversion rate.

92

: 00:04:19

The brand did not This one

also had 25 percent conversion

93

: 00:04:22

rate when the brand did not.

94

: 00:04:23

a, did we, and should we need to that

brand name, potentially not be, one of

95

: 00:04:28

the least expensive of the reason why

this one was spiked up 700 a day over

96

: 00:04:33

the weekend is because there's no one

watching Matt pricing on the weekend cause

97

: 00:04:36

they're all, at home with their family.

98

: 00:04:38

but those are the things too, it's like

where we have to train the algorithm.

99

: 00:04:41

So what Google doesn't know right

now is why bid on the brand name.

100

: 00:04:44

Google's going to say, I don't know, have

we had a bunch of sales in the brand name?

101

: 00:04:47

No, I'm not going there then.

102

: 00:04:49

And so that's the part two where.

103

: 00:04:51

We spiked over the weekend, but my

sales didn't come from, that's okay.

104

: 00:04:54

I had a great price.

105

: 00:04:54

So there's a few different things up

there is a, do we have the best price?

106

: 00:04:58

Probably not.

107

: 00:04:59

B was there anybody violating map?

108

: 00:05:00

Probably C is there any history in

that campaign to want to bid for those

109

: 00:05:06

names or anything else does Google

actually say actually these search terms

110

: 00:05:09

we think are going to convert better.

111

: 00:05:10

Was that true?

112

: 00:05:11

And do we give enough time?

113

: 00:05:12

through two other agencies for the

past year who were running, like

114

: 00:05:15

mostly just PMAX and the whole business

had been dying and dying for a year.

115

: 00:05:20

So I treated it like a new

account in that, it didn't know

116

: 00:05:23

what it was going to convert.

117

: 00:05:24

The tracking was almost non existent

because what happens in these, it's

118

: 00:05:28

almost like a B2B where the interior

designer will pick it out and it's

119

: 00:05:32

But the invoice goes to the end

client and the end client pays it.

120

: 00:05:35

So it can't track any conversions ever.

121

: 00:05:38

other part is that brand name, as an

example, that an Italian gelato dessert,

122

: 00:05:42

which is going to be really weird as well.

123

: 00:05:44

So we're going up against a bunch

of random people too, that are

124

: 00:05:46

trying to sell desserts on shopping.

125

: 00:05:48

which is funny, black

truffles and truffle zest.

126

: 00:05:50

the only thing that did seem to

work was to, switch it to max

127

: 00:05:55

CBC, set the max CBC, like 5.

128

: 00:05:58

See that might be where it kill it

though, too, that brand name could

129

: 00:06:01

have been hit in seven, eight.

130

: 00:06:02

Yeah, it was risky, but I

didn't know what else to do.

131

: 00:06:04

It wasn't bidding on brand names at all.

132

: 00:06:06

And it was just getting literally people

were searching for like Costco mirror.

133

: 00:06:10

I excluded the word Costco eventually,

but that's an example of like

134

: 00:06:13

just the vast market of people out

there who want like a 15 mirror.

135

: 00:06:17

And they're not willing to pay 4, 000.

136

: 00:06:19

So it was just, I didn't know what to do.

137

: 00:06:23

That part two is it's if the brand name

may not have saved it, I have, a bunch of

138

: 00:06:27

accounts that the brand name didn't work.

139

: 00:06:29

I haven't gone in over a

year because it never worked.

140

: 00:06:33

so the only way it worked is

when I beat their pricing and

141

: 00:06:35

they show up for cold traffic.

142

: 00:06:36

that was the secret.

143

: 00:06:37

so that's, what's interesting.

144

: 00:06:38

I think that there's more

that I'd have to go through.

145

: 00:06:40

We don't have access to it anymore.

146

: 00:06:41

My go to though, for everything right

off the bat it's always TRO as now

147

: 00:06:46

if I now know how to train that and

that's where it becomes really odd.

148

: 00:06:50

But that the other part too, is they have

to understand is when I look in the back

149

: 00:06:54

end of And this last seven days, for

example, like we pull back a bunch because

150

: 00:06:58

we're going through a funding thing,

but I spiked it up here over the weekend

151

: 00:07:01

that spiked up sales, but we have 14

five in last seven days and we spent two.

152

: 00:07:06

So we're at a seven X in this

last seven days at scale.

153

: 00:07:09

We never dip below a 6.

154

: 00:07:11

1.

155

: 00:07:11

So it worked.

156

: 00:07:12

It worked really well.

157

: 00:07:13

But that was because I know where

to set the 100 and 200 T row as in

158

: 00:07:16

order to give me a back end, five

and sevens and that kind of stuff.

159

: 00:07:19

so it's a TRO as bidding strategy,

but what you set that to is arbitrary.

160

: 00:07:24

What does Google know?

161

: 00:07:25

How much loss of attribution do you

have and what is your back end and

162

: 00:07:28

then say, what does that need to be on

the front end to then go through that

163

: 00:07:31

scenario on the back end and time lag and

attribution, enhanced conversions and.

164

: 00:07:36

Site speed is a slow and firing the

tag and missing a bunch of conversions.

165

: 00:07:40

And that needs to be

lowered to stay aggressive.

166

: 00:07:41

So it doesn't die whole bunch of stuff.

167

: 00:07:43

That's it's completely unique to that.

168

: 00:07:45

Even that CMS.

169

: 00:07:47

Okay.

170

: 00:07:48

you sure that if you were working with an

account that it was a thousand dollars a

171

: 00:07:51

month, you would still, are you confident?

172

: 00:07:53

'cause it's been a while since you've

worked on these small accounts.

173

: 00:07:56

like how confident are you on that t roas

from day one thing, a hundred percent.

174

: 00:08:00

Really?

175

: 00:08:01

Yeah.

176

: 00:08:01

my one account, here's a example.

177

: 00:08:03

we spend $40 a day for,

we're getting a: 2000

178

: 00:08:07

I said it 100 percent T Row OS.

179

: 00:08:09

Yeah, but it's been running for years, so

it has high quality data and everything.

180

: 00:08:13

But on PMAX, now we're

on standard shopping.

181

: 00:08:15

So that's the thing too, is yes, you can.

182

: 00:08:17

what you're spending per day, if you

need a higher CPC, you load a T Row OS.

183

: 00:08:22

just talking about a bidding strategy.

184

: 00:08:23

That's all we're talking about.

185

: 00:08:25

You can set a manual CPC, but then you

bid that way for everyone setting a

186

: 00:08:29

really low TRO as means that you said,

and it really aggressive bid strategy,

187

: 00:08:32

unless it's actually a fairly low chance.

188

: 00:08:34

Then bids go down.

189

: 00:08:36

I wish I could have said a

minimum CPC on that account.

190

: 00:08:38

That's what I wanted.

191

: 00:08:39

I was like, please stop

spending 50 cents on a click.

192

: 00:08:42

that's when you have

native keywords daily.

193

: 00:08:44

Yeah, which she wouldn't let me do.

194

: 00:08:46

You can have a brand focus

and you have a non brand.

195

: 00:08:48

so when, in the one you bid at a

higher two row as, and then you

196

: 00:08:51

negate every single number answer

would have been a genius strategy.

197

: 00:08:55

Give the client what they

want, but allow you to test.

198

: 00:08:56

Yeah.

199

: 00:08:57

And then you find out who wins.

200

: 00:08:58

I do have to jump.

201

: 00:09:00

But I didn't think of that.

202

: 00:09:01

Okay.

203

: 00:09:01

Bye, John.

204

: 00:09:02

Thanks everyone.

205

: 00:09:03

Thanks.

206

: 00:09:03

Bye.